Interview with Tom Lucas at FE Specialties in Sacramento, CA

[robroy]

Hello FORDification Members,

In Februrary 2010 I picked up a high performance, 406 cubic inch FE engine built for my truck by Tom Lucas at FE Specialties in Sacramento, California. Ryan (1971Ford) video-taped an interview during the visit.

Here's the engine thread: 390FE (406ci) for #50, built by Tom Lucas at FE Specialties.

The first interview part covers the questions that were specific to my engine, while the second part covers many of the general FE questions.

You'll find a complete transcript below each video. Note that I created the transcripts by listening with my fallible ears and typing with my fallible fingers. So I'm sure I've made mistakes. Also, to convey the video content more effectively, I trimmed out many of my one-syllable, passive affirmations like, "Yeah," and various "uh"'s, "oh"'s, and grunts.

Please also note that this forum software includes the word, "wrote," after each quotation, yet Tom didn't write any of this--this is a straight transcript from our verbal interview.

Video file formats: The WMV video files will play almost anywhere while the high quality H.264 (AVI) files play only on up-to-date computers.

Video: Tom Lucas at FE Specialties Interview, Part A: H.264 (75MB) WMV (69MB)


Begin Video Transcript for Part A

Robroy: Hi I'm Robroy, and I'm here with Tom Lucas at FE Specialties in Sacramento.

How you doin'?

Robroy: And I have some questions prepared for Tom about this beautiful 406 FE that he just built for me. So Tom, what are the biggest differences between this design, which you put together, and the design that was in the previous engine that I brought to you?

OK, well, the previous design was a low compression, big cam, unported, intake manifold motor that basically was not a balanced, engineered package for what you're trying to accomplish.

The cam was too big for the compression, the heads had no porting or relieving done, stock valve size, inverted seats, so basically, the motor how it was built wanted to run in the 800 to 3400 RPM range, and the camshaft that was chosen, wanted to run in the 2500 to 6000 RPM range. So you had basically an out of balance motor. So that would be the main difference.

Robroy: OK, great. So um, how would the truck behave with this design, compared to the initial design. Like what differences would you see in this truck, with its wide ratio and all that?

Well with the first motor, it was gonna be a little temperamental off idle, it's gonna hesitate a little bit, you were gonna have to bring RPMs up a little bit, above say eighteen hundred, you know two grand, somewhere in there, to get the engine the engine to be happy.

This motor's designed to be basically just off idle, happy, as soon as you hit the gas. And that will depend somewhat on the carburetor tune as you look in to as you proceed.

So this is a torque motor. The other motor was a stock motor trying to be combined with a hot rod motor and it wasn't. So this was engineered--the way I ported the heads, the size of the porting, the ratio of the runner as it runs in to the bowl area underneath the valve, the fact that we put the bigger valves changed that ratio a little bit, it gave you a little better low lift flow.

I didn't make the ports huge, as you'll see in some of the pictures, but the runner size if fairly constant for torque, that's like the old Ram manifolds of the Mopars, where they had the carbs sitting on either side of the valve cover, and this long Ram manifold, what that was, those were big engines in big, big cars, and they use that long runner length as a tune for torque. It broadened the torque range, it allowed more upper RPM horsepower but it also fed the cylinders well low. So this is similar [to] what I did here--what I do.

So now you have a split duration camshaft that's relatively small on the intake side for idle vacuum, but then you have the same split that's generally found in Cobra Jet cams, which the Ford engineers spent a lot of time figuring out how these motors respond, and that's due to the valve seat angle, this has got a 30 degree intake seat now instead of a 45, so that's a little different for low lift, and there's all sorts of uh, you know I could go on and on about this, but this motor now is built to be efficient from just off idle, up to about five grand--forty eight, five grand.

And because of the porting and the runner freedom, I guess the peak power is supposed to be around 5,200. So the more effective the heads are the more free flowing but small the longer your usable RPM range will be. So, does that make sense?

Robroy: It does, yeah [not true, since it was 95% over my head ]. And I think that's what I was after, was a to have it responsive at a wide range of RPMs with that transmission especially since its gears so far apart.

Right, yeah you need--the lower the torque the better. When you drop the gear to the next gear, the motor's not going to be unhappy.

Robroy: Yeah

We like happy motors.

Robroy: So Tom, what advice would you give on timing the engine? What settings would you recommend, and so on?

Well it's timed now.

Robroy: OK

And we had to verify your balancer, and I'll go over that with you, but FEs with stock combustion chambers generally like between 38 and 40 degrees total advance.

So you set the total--that's what you're concerned about with a centrifugal distributor on an MSD, you're worried about your total, not your initial. The initial just plays in to your RPM idle and the transfer slot position. And I think you're pretty close here. But we prefer the Holley carb' because that setup in the Holley is closer to what we like to set the initial timing at but not have the carb be too rich or too lean at that setting in the transfer slot. So the Holley carb does a better job of emulating where the FE wants to idle as far as the calibration of the carb.

Robroy: Oh, OK.

These carburetors [Edelbrock] are basically old AFB Carters that were on Mopars.

Robroy: Oh.

That's what they are. Just FYI.

Robroy: Yeah!

And back in the 70's, everybody took the Carters off and put Holleys on.

Robroy: Oh OK!

And went faster!

Robroy: Yeah! Well that might be what I wind up doing ultimately.

Well.

Robroy: Possibly

Yeah, they've done, they've actually helped them out quite a bit.

Robroy: Okay, so when I go to play around with the carburetor, do you have any specific advice that I might follow other than the instructions that came with it, for tuning it, and so on?

Well you always want to be leaning on the rich side, and then backing off. Okay, you don't want to lean on the lean side, and detonate the motor, you're at 9-7 to 1, so it's not real--10 to 1 with an iron head is border-line. 9-7 gives you a little leeway with premium gas. But you want to start off a little fat, and then back up a little bit.

Robroy: OK

Okay? And then, if you back up, and it gets faster and then you back up a little more, and it is goes slower, then you want to go back to, that second setting, do you follow me?

Robroy: Yeah

But you want lean on the fat side of the balancing act.

Robroy: Okay

So...

Robroy: 'cause that's the safe side.

You haven't touched it now, right? It's just stock out of the box. And this is richer of the two 750's.

Robroy: Oh, Okay

So, what I would do would be to go up a size on the rods, and the spring is gonna be...that's gonna be how you determine how it drives. You're gonna have to drive it first, and that in the, you know, the spring for the rod raise, determine when that rod raises. And you'll have to drive and load the truck, before you start messing with the spring size.

You might have to go to a jet change, really, you need to have somebody like myself--break the motor in, get some miles on it, and then do a plug read, and see where the motor is, and then plug read each time you do a change.

Robroy: Oh, okay.

Okay, that's the way it's supposed to be done.

Robroy: Yeah

And then the actual best way would be put it on a chassis dyno with an air/fuel mixture ratio and you'll know exactly what to do.

Robroy: Oh, okay

So, maybe what you could do is break the motor in, get around a thousand miles on it, then take it to a chassis dyno--a competent one. We have one up here it's SVS, that I'm real happy with. But they have to use a very high quality wide-band O2 sensor, so that they're measuring what the air/fuel mixture ratio is accurately. And then you can tune that carburetor in different settings: part throttle, part cruise, full throttle, heavy load, you guys can go and do it all at once.

Robroy: Oh.

So, that's really the way it should be done.

Robroy: Okay. So after I run it for what, around a thousand miles, and then I want to have that done?

Yep.

Robroy: Okay, great.

And you're gonna probably find some performance there, so it'll be worth it.

Robroy: Great. So, if I hook a vacuum gauge up to the intake manifold, about how much should I expect to see at idle, when things are operating properly.

Sixteen.

Robroy: About sixteen?

16, would be a good...16, 16 and 1/2, something like that.

Robroy: Okay, So um, how fast can this engine spin before there are any problems--what's it's red line for the tachometer...approximately?

5,800 RPM is where you want to keep this.

Robroy: As long as it's under 58'

Under 58'. This is a hydraulic roller with--I didn't put the real heavy spring in it, so you're gonna want to shift it no later than 58'. But, you're peak power is gonna be around 5,1', 5,200, so there's no reason to really go past 5,5'. See, you're gonna be going down--you can go a little over the peak power,
'cause that will bring your torque up when you change gears. But yeah 5,800 would be your red line.

Robroy: Great. So um, for my temperature gauge, where should I be looking for trouble, like how hot can it get before there's any kind of problem, would you say on this engine? More or less.

Yeah 220. If you see it get above that, you need to pull over and let it cool off.

Robroy: Got it. 220. That I will do.

But, it runs really cool. Every time I put a motor on this test stand I can kinda generally get an idea by how quick it heats up, by how long I've had it running. And this thing is running quite [cool]. So, you shouldn't ever see any issue.

Robroy: Okay. So um, given that it has the high volume pump, and windage tray installed, about how, what kind of oil quantity would you recommend.

It's 5 and 1/2 quarts in the pan, and a quart for the filter. So 6 and 1/2.

Robroy: Okay, would you recommend going beyond that at all, because of, let's see, what was it...the issue we were describing, since you know I'm going to race this, on the uh, on the Leguna Seca, that real twisty track, ya know.

Robroy: With a bunch of bails of...big bails of hay in the background

You're gonna chase Ryan--chase Ryan down to Baja.

Robroy: Yeah I'm gonna chase Ryan, with this, uh.

You know, I don't think it would hurt it to go to six quarts total. But here's the deal. You can check, you can put six quarts in it--run the motor, and pull the dipstick out--you shut it off, pull the dipstick out, if you see any bubbles on the end of the dipstick that means that the oil's getting aerated because it's a little too much in there. And you don't want that.

So, but you should be fine, 5 and a half quarts, with that high volume pump, is adequate. You're not gonna be, you know, sticking your left foot out the door going around turns I don't think. I could be wrong.

Robroy: Right foot out the door...

Video Transcript Complete for Part A

Here's the second part of Tom's interview, which focuses on general FE questions.

Video: Tom Lucas at FE Specialties Interview, Part B: H.264 (83MB) WMV (80MB)


Begin Video Transcript for Part B

Robroy: I have a few questions that are more general questions about FE motors that aren't specific to this one. The first one is, Tom, what are your favorite and least favorite things about FE engines?

Well they're all good.

Robroy: They're all good!

They're all good.

Robroy: Okay!

They make a lima bean look sad.

Robroy: All right

Now you guys know what a lima bean is?

Robroy: No.

Does Ryan know what a lima bean is?

Ryan: No.

Well those 460's were made in Lima, Ohio, so we just changed, instead of "Leema," it's Lima [pronounced like a Lima bean]. So the old back and forth rib getting between the FE crowd and the 385 series as they call them now is, "Ah you just got a lima bean."

Robroy: Oh okay.

But no, they're all good in their own way. FEs are a fantastic design.

The only negative--and it is a big one, but it can be verified--is the fact that it's a thin-wall block casting technology. So it kept the weight of the motor down, but if there was what we call "core shift," when the block was being poured, if the cores for the cylinder bores moved, then we got what we call "core shift" in the block, and one side could be fairly thin and one side could be fairly thick.

You do not get that with a "lima bean." Those are real thick blocks--there's not any issue. But they're real heavy. That 429 block [in Ryan's truck] by itself weights about 300 pounds. This FE block [the Yellow Jacket] weighs about 198 pounds.

But an FE has a shaft-mounted rocker, it's a high ratio so lift under the curve on the cam is way more efficient--it's 175, and it's very stable. It's about a 12 degree I believe, or 14 degree combustion chamber angle to the valve, so the flow on an FE head if it's looked at and worked, is very efficient. It's got a nice long rod from the factory, 6.5" long basically, so the torque is very good from these motors. Now Ford was smart with 429's, they put a 6.6" rod, whereas a big block Chevy has a 6.13" rod, so Ford has way more dwell time and more torque versus the same Chevy.

So the only negative on an FE--well, maybe there's another negative is, in order to change the valve train you gotta take the intake manifold off, or in order to take the intake manifold off you gotta take the valve train off...I guess would be a better way of saying it, so that's a negative. But on a positive side, if you change from a cast iron, boat anchor intake manifold to an aluminum, then you actually are half doing an aluminum head because it's actually part of the head. In other designs this would all be cast iron [pointing to the intake manifold ports] on other engine designs such as the big block Chevy or Ryan's 429. So you put an aluminum intake and you've got kind of a partial aluminum head.

So the only real negative--and then the stock oiling, in its stock configuration, not the 427 blocks, but all the other blocks, was not adequate for high RPM, performance, high horsepower. Whereas some of the other blocks it wasn't as critical, but most factory engines need upgrades in the oil. Okay, it's just a degree of how much. But remember that these [pointing to the Yellow Jacket] started off in Edsels. 332's and they weren't too concerned about, the Edsel going around NASCAR real fast at the time.

Robroy: Okay Yeah. All right. So Tom what makes the engines you build unusual--what, what parts of the building process are you best at and most proud of? How does it differ from an engine I'd get from another random builder?

Highly blueprinted. Exactly blueprinted to all specs. Piston height, obviously main, rod, cam clearance, ring end gap, piston clearance, cam degree, all that is extremely important here. And that's what makes any two motors run completely different is the blueprinting that's going on.

And then the engine design that we worked out, in other words the part interchanges with the cam, the size of the intake port runner, the compression, the deck height on the piston, that's what sets us apart from most other builders.

Your typical crate engine is just a process motor--and sometimes they get it right--okay, but they're process motor, they cannot put the time in to the motor or else they wouldn't have any profit in the motor. In order to verify all these, and to think about and change--I change all these specs depending on you, the truck, the vehicle, how you're going to use it. And the intake runner length size changes, the degree of the turn in to the intake port changes depending on the vehicle.

So all that design, and then the carb function, the distributor advance, the curve. By the way, your distributor was not curved--you weren't getting total advance 'til 4,600 RPM. So that's been changed. And that could really destroy your fuel mileage on the freeway. You run a centrifugal advance distributor with those heavy springs, you're only going to be sitting at 29, maybe 30 degrees, sucking all sorts of gas because you're retarded and the things heating up on you. So that aspect has to be looked at.

So every aspect of the motor processes have to be thought about and changed and verified. So that is the biggest thing that we do.

And we get our clearances to very exacting tolerances: to ten thousandths of an inch. The crank clearance and the rod and mains is done to ten thousandths of an inch. Not just to thousandths but to--your motor's sitting at '22 on the rod clearance: 0.0022. And I'll change that depending on how many miles the individual's trying to get out of the motor, how much horsepower they want out of it, what time period they want that horsepower out of it. All these things change depending on the usage of the motor.

Robroy: Okay well great. So this is kind of a funny question maybe, but what do you think about using sealed ball bearing, ball bearings instead of those oil impregnated bronze bushings for the pilot in the end of the crankshaft--what do you think about the difference?

They're good.

Robroy: It's an okay thing to do?

Yeah absolutely. Yeah all the factories have done with the small blocks are using a roller bearing, bushing so...it's a bearing now it's not a bushing obviously so. No that's a good thing. They're expensive for FEs. But no, that's good.

Robroy: Okay. So how 'bout this: um, when people bring an old FE to you, or one that they had build from another shop, what's the most common stuff that you find in the engine that was done incorrectly, or done strangely? What are the most common mistakes people make?

The most universal. Well in a few instances, and actually it's been quite a few, we have taken the pan off to discover that the thrust bearing, the main thrust bearing, was installed in the number five position instead of the number three position that all Fords use.

So, individuals who are used to GM products, where the main thrust bearing goes on number five, decided that this FE should be like a Chevrolet, and they installed the main thrust bearing on number five. And in fact, one individual had a '60 'Bird, and he had about a 140 thousandths crank' end play, which at times would make an incredible knocking noise. So that's been a common problem.

Over-camming, as such in yours, under compression, they'll put an FE around 9:1, which is...a lot of Chevys like 9:1, but FE's don't.

What else; I'm trying to think of stuff that's common that we see. I mean your motor was just a lot of things. And mainly that's what we'll see.

We just did a Shelby motor where the cam was advanced by about nine degrees and it was a small cam. And it was a big cubic inch motor, it was 486 cubic inches, so the torque peak was not...the motor was not efficient. You have all these cubic inches, but then they install a cam that's too small and it's advanced way too much. So that's an issue.

But I don't know if there's really any one boo-boo. If they're not aware of the oiling mods, I have seen that, in a lot of these rebuilds where they'll do performance upgrades to an FE and not do the oiling mods, and then start spinning rod bearings. Because if a machine shop, let's say a stock rebuilder type machine shop, does the machine work on the block, the crank, and the rods, they'll do what they call a mid-spec clearance. So they're gonna put the big-end bore of the block in mid-spec, they're gonna put the crank--and a lot of times, the crank is set on the big side. And I don't know why they do this but they'll cut the crank to the big side. Which in other words, it's not as--you know--the pin's bigger. Whatever: 10, 20, 30...they'll set it to the big side. There's about a thou' up and down clearance for that, and they'll a lot of times set it to the big side.

So what'll end up happening, is if they put everything quote-un-quote to the stock size, you can end up with a half a'thou' clearance on your rod bearing. All right, so somebody gets a new rebuilt motor, and they've done some upgrades like you have done, and they got a half'a'thou' clearance on the rod bearing. Well that clearance allows X amount of oil--oil's a coolant--okay, it's not only expansion factor involved, oil's a coolant, and the amount of clearance that's past that pin is the amount of oil that can flow past it. And X amount of oil is how much heat it can take away from that bearing.

So oil clearance sometimes is misconstrued as just a clearance, but it's actually room for oil, which is a coolant, to take heat off the bearing. The more horsepower you develop the more heat that bearing's gonna see--the more pressure it sees. So hence, you need more oil to cool that bearing and that crank' pin. I mean, it's not rocket science but it all has to equate. Your motor is a little tighter than, 'cause you're more of--you're a higher mileage, so I set it a little bit tighter. You're lookin' more for torque so you weren't going to rob.

Video Transcript Complete for Part B

Thanks again to Ryan (1971Ford) for filming this!
Robroy