Washington state permits for 26,000 pounds?

[Wes]

I know I have to have a CDL just so I can fix them.
here is the peoples republic of California DMV has to say

A commercial vehicle is a motor vehicle or combination used for hire to transport passengers or property or which:

* Has a gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) of 26,001 pounds or more
* Is designed, used, or maintained for carrying more than 10 passengers, including the driver
* Tows a vehicle or trailer, which has a GVWR of 10,001 pounds or more
* Transports hazardous materials, which requires placards
* Tows any combination of two trailers or vehicle and trailer
The or which is the killer. I have a class B cdl, I can drive any weight single vehicle and tow up to 10000k trailer.
I haven't talked to any DOT inspect since our last terminal inspection and all he did was piss and moan about how bad things at the CHP were. We kept him supplied with coffee and doughnuts sympathized with his situation. A few minor report filing issues and 2 loose bolts. We were lucky.
All you need is a buddy with a CDL and your good.

[ezernut9mm]

notice it says "for hire". that's the kicker right there. if it's not for hire, it's not a commercial vehicle.

[FLASH 1]

Sorry but " Not For Hire " or " For Hire " does not mean anything to the Dot,, GVWR'S over 10,000 is commercial go to a scale and if the officer will look it up,, I can go to our scale which is Hard Core picture taking scale and in the book it's high lighted and10,001 is for any combo as well if you go to some smaller scales they most likely don't know,, in the past 12 years have been pulled in all size trucks from the 350,450 to the 650 in all different states from Calif, NM, KS, CO. MD,NJ, NC, Texas, AZ, Wash. Wy, La. Ga, SC and maybe a few more forgot about and every officer 1st thing was opened the door looked at GVWR'S, then medical card, log book truck/trailer registration etc.. regardless if empty or loaded,, even in the F-350 with no trailer 2 tickets for radr detector WHY Over 10,001 lbs,, maybe I am little less in reading books, But do know what is needed, and so many times other vendors come to us to find what is needed since they have been ticketed or out of service so I will keep saying what has been shown to us ,, anybody can put not for hire on truck/trailer and does not mean xxxx when they open that door and see the GVWR'S , One other example for years NC been putting car tags on pickup's now all that haschanged since some need higher weights, Also ask yourself and this goes back several years WHY Does it say on OK Trucks on the bumper Commercial ?????????????????? there is a reason

[ezernut9mm]

Sorry but " Not For Hire " or " For Hire " does not mean anything to the Dot,, GVWR'S over 10,000 is commercial go to a scale and if the officer will look it up,, I can go to our scale which is Hard Core picture taking scale and in the book it's high lighted and10,001 is for any combo as well if you go to some smaller scales they most likely don't know,, in the past 12 years have been pulled in all size trucks from the 350,450 to the 650 in all different states from Calif, NM, KS, CO. MD,NJ, NC, Texas, AZ, Wash. Wy, La. Ga, SC and maybe a few more forgot about and every officer 1st thing was opened the door looked at GVWR'S, then medical card, log book truck/trailer registration etc.. regardless if empty or loaded,, even in the F-350 with no trailer 2 tickets for radr detector WHY Over 10,001 lbs,, maybe I am little less in reading books, But do know what is needed, and so many times other vendors come to us to find what is needed since they have been ticketed or out of service so I will keep saying what has been shown to us ,, anybody can put not for hire on truck/trailer and does not mean xxxx when they open that door and see the GVWR'S , One other example for years NC been putting car tags on pickup's now all that haschanged since some need higher weights, Also ask yourself and this goes back several years WHY Does it say on OK Trucks on the bumper Commercial ?????????????????? there is a reason

the scale master is not always right. even though he is always right, right then and can issue a ticket or cause a shut down. and even though i am not a lawyer, i'll almost bet that in court any good attorney could argue "motor vehicle used on a highway in interstate commerce to transport passengers or property " means that it must be used for business. "in interstate commerce" is pretty straight forward. as long as i am not hauling for anyone but myself-for pleasure i do not need a cdl.
so far this is just opinion based on the facts as i interpret them, but i do hope to put them to the test one day as i really want to get this big honkin' f500 down the street from me.

[averagef250]

The rigger lowed the Mori onto my trailer and the trailer said **#@!@#@^&$*$#. I hauled my 12K lb Mazak M4 yesterday, same trailer, no issues, the Mazak's weight is spread over 15 feet big difference apparently. The mori is 15,500 in a 4x4 foot square. It snapped 8 4x4's set on the deck and bowed the trailer deck 1.5" in the middle. Did some repairable damage to the leaf spring mounts.

I paid for a truck to haul it to a rigger in Portland and am in talks with my neighbor about removing a section of his fence so I can use a larger trailer to get it into my shop.

I really appreciate all the advice from you guys. After talking with the pros today sounds like I'd have had a very slim chance of squeeking a load like this by the Longview-Kelso weigh station on I-5. I'd have had to pay a rigger and truck to unload me on I-5 in addition to the fines (didn't factor that part in).

If anyone needs a rigger in Seattle area I'd highly recommend Checkmate Industries. Never seen anyone operate a forklift like that before, seriously talented guy.

[ezernut9mm]

glad you're getting it worked out dustin. hope you are on good terms with your neighbor.

[averagef250]

Finally got the mill to the shop today. Found out why you should always take a tape measure with you when looking at a machine, don't just trust the manual.

The book says the mill is 9 feet tall. My 12 foot door says otherwise. Mill is actually 10' 6". Hmmm. How could this be? Apparently I have 139th MV-45 Mori made and originally they had a hydraulically balanced spindle before later switching to the counterweight system I was expecting to find. Z servo and all the hydraulics sit above the machine on these old ones

Anyway, couldn't fit it through the door on the trailer so we had to rig it off the 37" deck trailer in the gravel driveway by hand. Got a new appreciation for the pyramid builders. I've moved some equipment before, but nothing quite so puckering as a very top heavy 15K with a 4x6' footprint swinging on cribbing and beams 45" off the ground. Every bit of cribbing I had wasn't close to enough for the job. Borrowed some large firewood rounds, tons of 6x6's, 4x4's, 4x8's and 20 sheets of 7/16 CDX cut into 16" squares did the trick though.

In the picture, the mill's in the air 2" above the trailer deck. Check out the bow in the 5x5X.250 tubing. I'm going to bed.

[FLATBEDFORD]

I hope having this machine is worth all the trouble. What PIA! Post more pictures when you wake up.

[averagef250]

Some pictures of the move turned up!

[averagef250]

In the future I will ask an engineer how much steel is needed to support weight like this. Found out after the move I was past the yield point of 5x5 .250 tubing, but it supported it somehow. I think the rear tube was supporting more than 6 tons in the middle of a 10 foot span at times. The tube is deflected over 1.5" in the pictures.

ENJOY!




***Don't try this at home!

[averagef250]

After the move, after all this work the mill was DOA. The machine electrical checked out, but the control refused to turn on or do anything. I thought I cooked something with the wrong phase rotation, but the Japs are pretty sharp and made the machine with protection for that. Got a wire-by-wire education on the insides of this thing for sure, eventually got a friend over who's one of the best CNC repair guys in the area. The problem didn't stump him, but after what he thought was a 10 minute fix turned into an 8 hour day he concluded that something in the controls PC didn't match the diagrams in the PC ladder diagram.

After some phone calls and emails to the prior owner the maintenance guy familiar with this mill calls me back and apologizes for failing to mention this mill has, to quote him, "an impossible to troubleshoot quirk". It had it's PC replaced some years back and sat dead for nearly two years until by chance, someone held the machine on and control on buttons down simultaneously for a full 30 seconds, then the control started and worked fine. Something wrong with the software in the new PC board that was replaced. I'm just happy it works.

Now, all is fine with the mill other than some toolchanger glitches. Hope to have DNC figured out next week and making parts soon after. Eventually I'll get the 4th axis figgerd out, but don't need it right now. It's a nice mill. Makes my Bridgport sitting next to it look like a drill press. Not saying this mill hasn't seen many repairs in 29 years, but it's hard to beleive it's in as nice shape as it is after production use cutting mostly stainless and ferrous. The ways look brand new.

[fbomb100]

I wish I was your neighbor....

[ezernut9mm]

glad it all worked out.

[nadams]

After all the trouble getting it home if it did not work I would have broke down and cried. Glad to hear it all worked out in the end. Now to what everyone is thinking but no one is asking, what cool parts are you going to make for us?

[averagef250]

You might be surprised what your neighbors have in thier outbuildings. Quite a few machine shops operate like this.

For now just making parts for the diesel conversions done here. Have 2 products I'll make on this and see how they sell. Hoping to avoid job shop machine work completely and anything real high volume would be better farmed out than done on this mill. Some old CNC machines like this mill keep going and going, but they aren't competitive in today's industry. It's a neat machine, probably perfect for me and my abilities, but not something a modern machine shop would ever own. The control is an antique and even though this mill was the fastest thing out there in the 80's today it's 500 ipm rapid speeds are 1/4 the cutting speed of a similiar machine today. This has a 6K rpm spindle and 5 second tool changes. Todays machines have 15K rpm spindles and <1 second tool changes. Basicly the rate this machine can remove metal is insignificant compared to the stuff out there today. Also, there's stuff this thing just flat can't do because of the control. It rigid taps, can do simultaneous 3 axis linear moves, but can only do 2 axis circular moves. No 3 axis circular means no thread milling.