The right choice (Need help)

[peanutman]

I haven' been on in a while but need help with a choice. Me and the wife are looking at buying a travel trailer. Will be 24-36 ft. Will also be purchasing a truck to pull it. It will be a neckover type trailer.

As a ford owner i am leaning toward a ford super duty diesel. I know nothing about diesels and this is something the wife will drive from time to time. I know this is a ford site but is ford my best option. Out of the big three and there diesel line ups which would be the right choice based on engines, trannys, reliability, fuel mileage, and ease of driving for the wife.

I know there mechanics, engine and tranny guys on here. I need your help.

[FreakysFords]

Are you looking towards a new or used truck?

For my money, the Duramax (GM) is OUT.

That leaves the Ford Powerstroke and the Dodge Cummins.

If you don't mind stepping back to the 7.3, I'd personally jump at the Ford. The 6.0 is fine, but you REALLY need to check it out first (and know what to look for), and you want to know it was properly maintained.

I won't buy ANY 6.0 without an exhaust gas test. Most good diesel shops and all Ford shops should be able to test it in short order.

Up to the 6.4, the Powerstroke used dual oil systems from one common source (standard wet sump oil pan). The first oil system is the one you're already familiar with, where as the second is the high pressure oil that "fires" the injectors. For this reason, oil changes and ANTIFOAMING oil are of great importance. Anyone running standard automotive oil in a PS is looking for trouble. I run Rotella, but there are a couple other options (incl FoMoCo). Whatever oil is used, antifoaming and zinc are important properties.

The 6.4 uses the "mercedes method" IE it charges high pressure fuel externally for common rail injectors. For this reason, the second high pressure oil system is no longer. On these, there is actually a fuel cooler. I can't speak to any great detail on their reliability or such as they had just came out when I left the shop.

As to Dodge, they use cummins. I can say that good about them.

[papabug71]

Whats a neckover? 5th wheel?

The 6.0 is garbage. Stay away from it unless you want to spend big bucks later down the road. The rule of thumb on the 6.0 is if it aint broke yet, it will later on.

The 7.3 is a good motor. Not a super powerhouse, but a good diesel engine none the less. I have nothing bad to say about it other than stock motor vs. stock motor a 12v Cummins will outrun & outpull the 7.3. I have seen it done many times & ive done it a couple of times myself.

Im not familiar with the 6.4 Ford, so i wount comment on it for lack of expierence.

GM trucks are insanely over priced. I'll never buy anything GM again.

I love dodge trucks, but the newer Dodge trucks im not too fond of either. If I was looking for a good pulling truck, I would try to find a '94-'98 12v Cummins in good shape. They're hard to find in great shape, but every now & then I see them on ebay, CL etc. One owner trucks & such. I've owned two Dodge diesel trucks over the years & they were both great trucks. I never had any problems out of them except for the ISB burning up lift pumps. To my knowledge, every '98.5 - '02 had this problem. It was quite common.

All of this is my opinion. I dont want to start any battle roy-als.

averagef250 will be along shortly. He has forgot more about diesel engines than I will ever know about them.

[hazelnut]

I just sold a 06 powerstroke with the 6.0 and 125,000mi and after spending $3,000 on it for new injectors, alt. and other stuff and installing myself i was glad to see it go. dont waste your money on a 6.0. Ive got a 99 F350 w/ 7.3 and 265,000mi on it and weighs 16,000lbs average and love it, has good power and runs strong. Ive never owned a dodge so i can say on the them, but the 7.3 is a very good motor. I will pull a car on the trailer without unloading the truck and have good power. 7.3 is a good motor thats been around for a while and was the best engine ford had in its diesel lightduty trucks.. I traveled with my work and talk to people that travel the east coast working and from what ive heard about the dodges is the cummins is great but the trucks have problems with the steering and brakes.

[fireguywtc]

A say GM is out as well because of the price, but if you can afford a duramax, they are good reliable trucks.

Dodge has the best diesel motor, but the tranny can be a weak point if an auto. What I don't like about them is the chassis. Electroics and interior of earlier models (pre2004) are crap. They also did not have a true crew cab until this year, if you are looking for one of those.

I like the Fords best for the overall good package. My first was a 97 stroke with a 5spd and it was good. They can be made to have more hp over the stock 225 with some work. The 4spd autos in those trucks were considered weak, but if you are just towing once in a while they will be fine with routine maint. The superduty's with the 7.3s were a bit strong since they came with intercoolers and more hp from the factory. 250 with auto and 275 with a manual if that says anything. Again the autos were fine for moderate towing and occasional use.

The 6.0s have been notorious, but I have had 2 with good success. The earlier models 03/04 had the most problems and 05-07 got a bit better. Main issues were EGR and headgaskets that can be fixed to not fail. They have great trans. and good power in stock trim. I have a ton more info. on them if you want to get with me.

The 6.4s are good but have two main problems, the emissions junk and horrible gas milage because of it. The emissions stuff can get clogged and cause the truck to lose power and even more MPGs.

Just to be clear the Fords prior to the 6.4 had the HEUI hydraulic of electric fuel injection. The only time I broke down in the 97 was when the high pressure oil pump went out. It was at around 160k when it went and cost about $1100 to fix. The 6.4 has the common rail injection system with piezo injectors. AFAIK they have been good. The new 6.7 Ford psd is supposed to be awsome from the reviews I have heard from those who can afford them, but I would never buy another motor that has less then 2 years on the market.

If you want to build the ultimate truck, get a Ford superduty, drop a Cummins in it backed with an Allison trans.

[peanutman]

Thanks for the feedback so far. I have heard that dodge has tranny problems in automatics which i am leaning toward for the wife, otherwise you can't beat them. All the dodges iv'e seen have body issues. I just don't know much about the duramax other than they are running allison trannys.

My dad had a 88 ford diesel, not sure if it was 6.0 or 6.4. I know he pulled a good size dozer with it and it was stout, but he had injector pump issues several times. if i can find a good used truck/trailer package i will go that route but may be limited on choice. If i buy new im not sure where to start on trucks.

[fordman]

stay with ford. the 7.3 is bettter than the older 6. whatevers were.

[Old Bird]

Meh, I had a 2004 6.0 and it was the best truck ever. 8,000 pound beast of a truck (long bed, crew cab, Lariat FX4 4x4). I put about 120,000 miles on it then sold it to my BiL, who has put another 50,000 hard miles on it. There were some bad injectors on some of the early trucks, but mine never had a problem, most never had a problem. Be sure to get an OASIS report from the dealer, that will show you all the dealer work done on the truck, including recalls. The ones that have had problems seem to always have problems.

That truck would pull anything. The meanest I was to it was when I bought my full sized Jeep Grand Wagoneer (4000+pounds), loaded it onto a two car hauler loaded with other junk, then drove up the 40 mile incredibly steep grade out of Phoenix to Flagstaff on a 109 degree July day. I was doing 80+ up the hill with the AC blowing at max, and it's the first time I even heard the aux fan come on. Truck handled it fine.

[Old Bird]

That was an auto by the way. My wife drove the truck sometimes, but didn't like how big it was. She had no problem driving it other than that.

[hazelnut]

When i had my 06 at ford six times at $90 each to be scand to figure out why the truck run like crap. the scan showed the truck running fine, but when you give it fuel it would shake their labtop down the seat and all of them would tell me they didnt know what was wrong with it but could bring it in the shop and work on it for $90 per hour. no thank you. the 6.0 had so many problems that ford had to sued international over the lawsuits they were being sued over because of breakdowns and people dieing in ambulances on the way to the hospital. Ford made every dealership have a diesel mechanic because of the 6.0 breaking down and haveing so many problems. when i started asking other people with diesels about what they thought could be wrong with my truck, i was told over and over if its got 125,000mi on it it needs new fuel injectors. when i checked prices for replaceing them the average was $4,000. my truck was fully loaded with every option you could get and i sold it for $10,000 below NADA to get rid of it and felt lucky to get that with the reputation that the 6.0 has.

[papabug71]

The 6.0 cost Ford millions in warranty work & utimately lead up to the seperation of Ford & Navistar. Even Ford Motor Co. said the 6.0 is trash.

4054 people on one forum cant be wrong: http://www.powerstroke.org/forum/archiv ... f-177.html

[fireguywtc]

They are right that the 6.0 had problems that did cause a lot of warranty claims and problems between Ford and International. They are wrong if they think or say they cannat be made into good reliable motors in stock form when their known issues are fixed. Mainly fix the EGR problems, add a coolant filter, and put head studs in them. The reason some had injector problems is because they are oil actuated. So it is very important to keep good clean oil in the motor as well as fuel. Many people are putting bypass oil systems in them but I would always recommend changing the oil regularly on both the 7.3 and 6.0.

btw. peaunutman, the 88 would of had the old 6.9 idi. good motors but slow.

Hazelnut, yes there was class action suits filed over ambulances with the 6.0, but this is a classis example of many lawyers taking after money. These things happened before and after the 6.0 and with other brands as well. Because the 6.0 had reputation, people wanted to sue them.

Main problem was the 6.0 was rushed to market and the earlier years had more problems generally. The later years had fixes. The rest of the weak points can be fixed to make a good reliable truck.

That said, some day when I wear out my 6.0 engine I want to swap in a Cummins. I love my truck and would love a Cummins in it more.

[Old Bird]

The 6.0 cost Ford millions in warranty work & utimately lead up to the seperation of Ford & Navistar. Even Ford Motor Co. said the 6.0 is trash.

4054 people on one forum cant be wrong: http://www.powerstroke.org/forum/archiv ... f-177.html

Considering how many MILLIONS of these trucks were sold, 4000 people can be wrong, at least when you're looking at something in general. Last I looked there were something like 12,000 claims for lemons, which is a very small percentage of the trucks that are out there. Higher than many cars, yes, but a far cry from a majority of the truck.

There are still many millions on the road prividing good, reliable service, and many, many, ambulance and fire services still use them. This is the perfect example of a rumor that has taken on far, far greater life of its own than the original kernel of truth. I can't tell you how many times I heard: "no, I don't have a 6.0, but a friend of my second cousin's wife's hairdresser once said . . ."

[hazelnut]

Ive been going to the dealership for the past two months buying parts and getting advice on fixing the 6.0 i had. My cousin works their as a mechanic but dosent work on diesels but i would stop in a say hi when i go buy their. almost everytime i go their i see a 6.0 with the cab lifted up in the air because its easyer to pick up ther cab and work on it than it is to work on it under the hood. if a 6.0 needs head gaskets than lifting the cab is a must because the headbolts will not come out without lifting the cab. I parked a 99 7.3 beside a 06 6.0 and looked under the hoods just to see the difference, the 7.3 you could look and see what needs to be unbolted to get where you want to work on it at, the 6.0 has every space that could be filled with unnessarry stuff under the hood, i was amazed that ford could take something that had room to work on it and just cram it full of stuff to take up room under the hood for no reason. I guess their is a reason that it needs 4 computers to run it, but as far as simple maintaince like changing the belt, its not simple anymore. i like the looks of the 06 a lot better than the 99, but if i was given a choice to have and maintanice the two engines, the 7.3 wins hands down. Ask any parts man at ford dealerships what he thinks of the 6.0, most of them are going to say " their a expencive motor" and cost a lot of money to maintain. http://www.powerstroke.org/ this forum is just for powerstrokes so you can read what the owners are saying about each of them. Im sorry if it sounds like i dont like the 6.0 but my personal experince with them has cost me a bunch of money.